Re: R: [amsat-bb] get a clue...

[k0vty@xxxxxxxx]

Hi Dom

Can you tell me why the L ban does not have a Lelia to control the up
link ERP ?

Joe  K0VTY
=======================
On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 15:00:35 +0100 "i8cvs" <domenico.i8cvs@tin.it>
writes:
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lee <lee-fl@cfl.rr.com>
> To: <amsat-bb@AMSAT.Org>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 4:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] get a clue...
> 
> 
> > There are several things which I believe contribute to this 
> problem.
> >
> > 1.  In some cases it is an attempt to compensate for a simple lack 
> of
> > receive sensitivity.  Stations hearing the excessively strong 
> L-band
> signals
> > don't realize how marginal their receive set up is.
> >
> 
> Lee and Kevin,
> 
> Many stations using L-band uplink are really at the same level or 
> constantly
> stronger than the beacon by 6 dB or more all the time as i can see 
> on my
> panoramic receiver wich is constantly connected to the IF of my 2400 
> MHz
> downconverter and they are strong not because those stations 
> hearing
> excessive strong L-band signals are using marginal receiver 
> sensitivity but
> because those L-band signals are strong in reality including 
> sometime my
> self.
> 
> Excessive strong L-band signals are possible because LEILA do not 
> operate
> for the L-band uplink and actually i can increase my L-band power to 
> any
> level i like and i can be as many dB over the beacon i  decide 
> without the
> intervention of LEILA
> 
> The problem is that many radio operators in the passband instead to
> disregard those stations using very high level downlink through the 
> L-band
> congratulates instead with those L-band operators for their strong 
> signals
> and they are happy to make QSO hearing strong signals so that the 
> pile-up
> over a 6 dB or more signal over the beacon is higly populated and
> continuously operating particularly when the moon is not in range 
> for some
> EME operators.
> 
> Remember that if a signal is at the level or more than the beacon 
> this
> signal is coming from the L-band uplink because LEILA do not operate 
> in it.
> and is not coming from the U-band.
> 
> > 2. The L-band rx AGC does not restrict users of this band to the
> recommended
> > MB-10db signal level.  As a result some stations attempt to 
> achieve the
> same
> > excessive levels using the 70cm uplink resulting in decreased 
> U-Rx
> > sensitivity.
> 
> Stations using excessive 70 cm uplink power cannot achieve the same
> excessive level of those using L-band because LEILA put  a notch 
> and
> the siren to the U-band offending signals for level just 8 dB belove 
> the
> beacon. If i use the U-band uplink i cannot desense the U-band 
> receiver and
> i cannot desense the L-band receiver at all because of the above 
> LEILA
> limitations.
> 
> Normally my 70 cm and 23 cm TX are ON all the time and some time i 
> prefere
> to use the U-band uplink but as soon LEILA get a notch on me i can 
> switch
> immediately to the L-band and i can continue to discusse with my 
> friends
> even with a stronger signal over the LEILA siren using the L-band 
> uplink !
> 
> > 3.  The U-rx AGC has been driven so high for so long that everyone 
> now
> > considers it normal to run 4 to 8 times the recommended 100w 
> EIRP.
> 
> If i run 4 or 8 times more power than the recommended power for the
> U-band, LEILA put a notch on me and i get the siren on,so that
> i cannot desense the transponder using U-band but i can easily 
> desense the
> transponder for everybody using the L-band because LEILA do not 
> operate in
> it.
> 
> Without LEILA for the L-band the actual EIRP depends only by a 
> decision
> of the L-band  operator but for the U-band operator is LEILA that 
> decides.
> 
> The difference existing between the limitation using high power on 
> U-band
> because of LEILA intervention and the freedom of using any power in 
> L-band
> without any limitation by LEILA make the operation of the AO40 
> transponder
> impartial because the users become divided in to two different 
> categories
> Those that are limited by a good  impartial roule and those that are 
> only
> limited by their roules.
> 
> > Take a look at some AO-40 AGC data downloaded from the archive for 
> this
> > month.
> > http://home.cfl.rr.com/lmclamb/ao40agc1202.html
> >
> 
> A test of desensing  was made by G3WDG, DJ1KM, 4X1AS and my self 
> some monts
> ago and this indicates that using U-band the SSB is mostly affected 
> by LEILA
> and that CW or a steady carriers like SSTV are  less affected  by 
> LEILA for
> example.
> 
>  > Lee-KU4OS
> 
> Lee and Kevin
> 
> I cannot understand why i should have the freedom to overload and 
> desense
> everybody in the passband using the L-band and i cannot do the same 
> using
> the U-band because of LEILA and i cannot understand why LEILA is 
> not
> operating  for the L-band or cannot be switched time to time between 
> the
> U-band and the L-band in a more balanced operating democracy.
> 
> Technical problems or what  ?
> 
> 73" de i8CVS Domenico
> 
> 
>  ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "kevin schuchmann" <kschuchm@pacbell.net>
> > To: <amsat-bb@AMSAT.Org>
> > Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 16:55 PM
> > Subject: [amsat-bb] get a clue...
> >
> >
> > > Hi All,
> > >    could people please get a clue on AO40?  everyone has run too 
> much
> > power
> > > at one time or another
> > > including myself... but I try not to... yet there are stations 
> that are
> > > always way too loud... pass after pass... I'm talking beacon 
> level
> here...
> > >
> > > GET A CLUE!!! tune down and look at the beacon, I don't care 
> what your
> > setup
> > > is... it doesn't matter..
> > > but look at that beacon... see where it is on your meter??? be 
> under it
> by
> > > at least a couple s units....
> > >
> > >  and another thing,everyone loves to praise cw, how it can get 
> through
> > when
> > > ssb wont cut it.... then how come so many cw stations are 
> beacon
> level???
> > > DUH!!!
> > >
> > > I'm sure that a lot of people have seen this behavior and have 
> seen the
> > > results... agc clamping the passband... and splatter and  images 
> on the
> > > passband....
> > >
> > > If you only get the beacon a s unit or two above your noise 
> guess
> what...
> > > you need to fix your receive and probably shouldn't be on the 
> sat till
> you
> > > fix that....
> > >
> > > ok rant mode off... shields up!!
> > >
> > > Kevin
> > > WA6FWF
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----
> > > Via the amsat-bb mailing list at AMSAT.ORG courtesy of 
> AMSAT-NA.
> > > To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe amsat-bb" to 
> Majordomo@amsat.org
> >
> > ----
> > Via the amsat-bb mailing list at AMSAT.ORG courtesy of AMSAT-NA.
> > To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe amsat-bb" to 
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> 
> 
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> ----
> Via the amsat-bb mailing list at AMSAT.ORG courtesy of AMSAT-NA.
> To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe amsat-bb" to Majordomo@amsat.org
> 
> 

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